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Brian Whatcott
science forum Guru Wannabe
Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 267
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 Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 2:59 am Post subject:
Re: More Funding Questions.
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On 2 Apr 2006 18:49:18 -0700, "Jon Baum" <brighteyedidealist@yahoo.ca>
wrote:
| Quote: | In light of this tempest of response in such a short time, I would
like to pick your brains about the possible sale price of some other
suggested projects:
////
II:
An automated aircraft (suggested by the same girl who proposed the
minisub) capable of attaining speeds of 20mph, flying at over 200
meters of elevation, carrying a small (75 gram) payload, evading
detection, and flying for over three hours in favorable weather
conditions.
Once again, your suggestions would be most greatfully appreciated.
Sincerely yours,
-Jon Baum
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A project that started out as a glorified model airplane has flown the
Atlantic autonomously. A model plane flying at a reasonable height is
rather difficult to spot. Particularly if it has a half way decent
muffler.
Brian Whatcott Altus OK |
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Herman Family
science forum Guru Wannabe
Joined: 14 Jun 2005
Posts: 173
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| Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 5:19 am Post subject:
Re: More Funding Questions.
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"Brian Whatcott" <betwys1@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:pdc6321lebi117c2psb3hn43lglb3betu7@4ax.com...
| Quote: | On 2 Apr 2006 18:49:18 -0700, "Jon Baum" <brighteyedidealist@yahoo.ca
wrote:
In light of this tempest of response in such a short time, I would
like to pick your brains about the possible sale price of some other
suggested projects:
////
II:
An automated aircraft (suggested by the same girl who proposed the
minisub) capable of attaining speeds of 20mph, flying at over 200
meters of elevation, carrying a small (75 gram) payload, evading
detection, and flying for over three hours in favorable weather
conditions.
Once again, your suggestions would be most greatfully appreciated.
Sincerely yours,
-Jon Baum
A project that started out as a glorified model airplane has flown the
Atlantic autonomously. A model plane flying at a reasonable height is
rather difficult to spot. Particularly if it has a half way decent
muffler.
Brian Whatcott Altus OK
|
I'm still wondering about the "avoid detection" part of the spec. I can see
"Avoid collision" which would be a pretty good endeavor. Actually, having a
small flock of these flying around could be an interesting endeavor. They
would each have to work out their relative position in the flock, balance
out the needs of the flock with their needs (the lead plane must be
rotated). It might teach us a little about the dynamics of mass flight and
migrations.
Michael |
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Smitty
science forum addict
Joined: 21 Apr 2005
Posts: 51
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| Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 2:33 pm Post subject:
Re: More Funding Questions.
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In article <OrIYf.6181$tT.3365@news01.roc.ny>,
"Herman Family" <ecalptsudwaseht.in.reverse@frontiernet.net> wrote:
| Quote: |
I'm still wondering about the "avoid detection" part of the spec. I can see
"Avoid collision" which would be a pretty good endeavor. Actually, having a
small flock of these flying around could be an interesting endeavor. They
would each have to work out their relative position in the flock, balance
out the needs of the flock with their needs (the lead plane must be
rotated). It might teach us a little about the dynamics of mass flight and
migrations.
Michael
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Do birds have midair collisions? How the hell *do* they fly in such
large, close formations? |
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Brian Whatcott
science forum Guru Wannabe
Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 267
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| Posted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 9:01 pm Post subject:
Re: Request information about the sale price of a fully automated miniature submarine.
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On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 09:54:34 -0500, jim <"sjedgingN0sp"@m@mwt.net>
wrote:
///
| Quote: | The whole thing sounds pretty bogus. As far as I can tell to satisfy
the problem requirements the class simply needs to build a device that
will submerge out of sight and then reappear 6 weeks later. For the
professor to check on the rest of his silly requirements would require
equipment even more sophisticated then his theoretical device itself.
-jim
|
Hmmmm... to check for 100 meter submersion capability I would be
tempted to do what is done with watches. Put them in a strong
container full of water, then apply 150 psi of air or preferably hand
pumped water. (A converted grease gun would do nicely) That
sophisticated little test might cost me - oh $15??
Isn't that how engineers usually test?
Brian Whatcott Altus OK |
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Brian Whatcott
science forum Guru Wannabe
Joined: 09 May 2005
Posts: 267
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| Posted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 1:19 am Post subject:
Re: More Funding Questions.
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On Wed, 05 Apr 2006 07:33:58 -0700, Smitty Two
<prestwhich@earthlink.net> wrote:
| Quote: | In article <OrIYf.6181$tT.3365@news01.roc.ny>,
"Herman Family" <ecalptsudwaseht.in.reverse@frontiernet.net> wrote:
I'm still wondering about the "avoid detection" part of the spec. I can see
"Avoid collision" which would be a pretty good endeavor. Actually, having a
small flock of these flying around could be an interesting endeavor. They
would each have to work out their relative position in the flock, balance
out the needs of the flock with their needs (the lead plane must be
rotated). It might teach us a little about the dynamics of mass flight and
migrations.
Michael
Do birds have midair collisions? How the hell *do* they fly in such
large, close formations?
|
High gain dynamic pitch, roll, yaw and thrust control?
In a thimble sized brain. Gotta love it.
Brian Whatcott Altus OK |
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Herman Family
science forum Guru Wannabe
Joined: 14 Jun 2005
Posts: 173
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| Posted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 5:51 am Post subject:
Re: More Funding Questions.
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"Brian Whatcott" <betwys1@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:t0r8325n3sdfn0jt4a2s3d6kp0ebmr6i84@4ax.com...
| Quote: | On Wed, 05 Apr 2006 07:33:58 -0700, Smitty Two
prestwhich@earthlink.net> wrote:
In article <OrIYf.6181$tT.3365@news01.roc.ny>,
"Herman Family" <ecalptsudwaseht.in.reverse@frontiernet.net> wrote:
I'm still wondering about the "avoid detection" part of the spec. I can
see
"Avoid collision" which would be a pretty good endeavor. Actually,
having a
small flock of these flying around could be an interesting endeavor.
They
would each have to work out their relative position in the flock,
balance
out the needs of the flock with their needs (the lead plane must be
rotated). It might teach us a little about the dynamics of mass flight
and
migrations.
Michael
Do birds have midair collisions? How the hell *do* they fly in such
large, close formations?
High gain dynamic pitch, roll, yaw and thrust control?
In a thimble sized brain. Gotta love it.
Brian Whatcott Altus OK
|
That in a thimble size brain would be remarkable, but in addition to those
more regulatory level controls, there is real time pattern recognition,
navigation in 3D, and probably a few other high level processes going on.
And a thimble would be a rather large brain for a bird.
Just a thought, but if birds are in a wedge, I wonder if their cognitive
load is reduced, conserving energy for muscles. I know that their muscular
load is reduced because of the wedge pattern, except for the lead bird. It
seems that just keeping a relative position is much easier than the level of
navigation they do flying around in a forest. I've noticed that they don't
keep the exact relative positions, but tend to wander within the pattern a
good bit. Geese also practice formations on the ground for a week or two
before the big flights start. I've watched them march around the parking
lot in wedge formation before they finally decide to start honking up a
storm and finally take off in formation.
A flock of independent planes would be a good research project. I wonder if
they'd let an old control engineer in on the project....
Michael |
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Herman Family
science forum Guru Wannabe
Joined: 14 Jun 2005
Posts: 173
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| Posted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 5:52 am Post subject:
Re: Request information about the sale price of a fully automated miniature submarine.
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"Brian Whatcott" <betwys1@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:qkb832t461623ncgfpkntdok6llj4b5jc1@4ax.com...
| Quote: | On Sun, 02 Apr 2006 09:54:34 -0500, jim <"sjedgingN0sp"@m@mwt.net
wrote:
///
The whole thing sounds pretty bogus. As far as I can tell to satisfy
the problem requirements the class simply needs to build a device that
will submerge out of sight and then reappear 6 weeks later. For the
professor to check on the rest of his silly requirements would require
equipment even more sophisticated then his theoretical device itself.
-jim
Hmmmm... to check for 100 meter submersion capability I would be
tempted to do what is done with watches. Put them in a strong
container full of water, then apply 150 psi of air or preferably hand
pumped water. (A converted grease gun would do nicely) That
sophisticated little test might cost me - oh $15??
Isn't that how engineers usually test?
Brian Whatcott Altus OK
|
That or get a diving suit, and take the unit down until the 100 meter watch
failed.... :)
Michael |
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paul
science forum beginner
Joined: 06 Apr 2006
Posts: 1
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| Posted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 7:01 pm Post subject:
Re: More Funding Questions.
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"Jon Baum" <brighteyedidealist@yahoo.ca> wrote in message
news:1144028958.678835.296290@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
| Quote: | In light of this tempest of response in such a short time, I would
like to pick your brains about the possible sale price of some other
suggested projects:
I:
A Gauss gun (for those of you who are unfamiliar with the term, a Gauss
gun is a series of electromagnetic coils surrounding a tube, a magnetic
projectile is placed at one end, and each of the coils is activated in
sequence, causing rapid acceleration of said projectile. For those of
you who do know, I apoligise for being patronising, or pedantic; it
comes with the proffession.) capable of launching a projectile at
anywhere between a pellet gun and a rifle, with as short a length of
time between shots as possible (the capacitators need to charge) and
also able to hit a target (no larger than 25 cm by 25 cm) accurately at
a distance of 250 meters.
II:
An automated aircraft (suggested by the same girl who proposed the
minisub) capable of attaining speeds of 20mph, flying at over 200
meters of elevation, carrying a small (75 gram) payload, evading
detection, and flying for over three hours in favorable weather
conditions.
Once again, your suggestions would be most greatfully appreciated.
Sincerely yours,
-Jon Baum
A search of the faculty at - http://cgi.asu.edu/sfs/search |
lists no Jon Baum. Also slightly suspicious is the yahoo.ca email address. |
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jmh
science forum beginner
Joined: 26 Apr 2006
Posts: 1
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| Posted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 11:39 pm Post subject:
Re: More Funding Questions.
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"Herman Family" <ecalptsudwaseht.in.reverse@frontiernet.net> writes:
| Quote: | good bit. Geese also practice formations on the ground for a week or two
before the big flights start. I've watched them march around the parking
lot in wedge formation before they finally decide to start honking up a
storm and finally take off in formation.
|
This bit about the practice is, to me, almost more amazing
that the flight and contol with limited brain size.
jmh |
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