FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups 
 ProfileProfile   PreferencesPreferences   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 
Forum index » Science and Technology » Physics » Fusion
Why can't particle accelerators produce fusion?
Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 1 of 1 [3 Posts] View previous topic :: View next topic
Author Message
Bruce Scott TOK
science forum addict


Joined: 05 May 2005
Posts: 75

PostPosted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 3:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Why can't particle accelerators produce fusion? Reply with quote

Eastmond asked:

Quote:
I was wondering why one can't just accelerate tritium and deuterium
nucleii in particle accelerators and make the beams collide to produce
fusion. I assume the problem would be that even though there's enough
energy in the collision the nucleii would just fly apart before they
had time to fuse.

This would be a form of inertial confinement fusion (ICF for inertial
confinement fusion)... the energy cost in overcoming all sorts of
dynamical instabilities (you are suggesting a non neutral plasma) is too
great, much greater than for magnetic confinement (MFE for magnetic
fusion energy).

Rest assured, this approach was well thought of, and tried.
For a variant using cyclotron motion in magnetic fields google 'MIGMA'
It works well for low densities but the cost of increasing the density
to useful levels is too great.

Quote:
To counteract this problem I've been thinking that one could use a
"funnel" to keep the beams together long enough for fusion to occur.
One could fire a beam of tritium nucleii and a beam of deuterium
nucleii at 45 degrees to each other into an electrostatically
positively charged tube. The beams would collide at high energies but
the nucleii would be prevented from scattering away from each other by
the electrostatic repulsion from the tube. Hopefully the nucleii would
fuse to produce helium nucleii which would be ejected at high velocity
out of the other end of the tube.

Think more about this... the field will dynamically react, and time
dependent electric fields involve magnetic fields (and vice versa). If
you get the density up high enough to neglect the displacement current
(you need 4 pi nM c^2 >> B^2) this becomes an MHD problem and then you
get to deal with the back reaction of Alfven wave effects.

Colliding beam fusion is still at relatively low level an active
research topic. But the prospects so far do not equal those of MFE or
ICF.

--
ciao,
Bruce

drift wave turbulence: http://www.rzg.mpg.de/~bds/
Back to top
Brian McDermott
science forum beginner


Joined: 20 Aug 2005
Posts: 25

PostPosted: Sun Jun 25, 2006 2:37 am    Post subject: Re: Why can't particle accelerators produce fusion? Reply with quote

eastmond@yahoo.com wrote:
Quote:
Hi,

I was wondering why one can't just accelerate tritium and deuterium
nucleii in particle accelerators and make the beams collide to produce
fusion. I assume the problem would be that even though there's enough
energy in the collision the nucleii would just fly apart before they
had time to fuse.

To counteract this problem I've been thinking that one could use a
"funnel" to keep the beams together long enough for fusion to occur.
One could fire a beam of tritium nucleii and a beam of deuterium
nucleii at 45 degrees to each other into an electrostatically
positively charged tube. The beams would collide at high energies but
the nucleii would be prevented from scattering away from each other by
the electrostatic repulsion from the tube. Hopefully the nucleii would
fuse to produce helium nucleii which would be ejected at high velocity
out of the other end of the tube.


You can use particle accelerators to produce fusion reactions! It is
done all the time as a way to generate neutrons for research purposes.
You can do this in your own home with the proper equipment. It won't
generate net power though, as there are far too many losses.
Back to top
eastmond@yahoo.com
science forum beginner


Joined: 12 Jan 2006
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2006 11:04 pm    Post subject: Why can't particle accelerators produce fusion? Reply with quote

Hi,

I was wondering why one can't just accelerate tritium and deuterium
nucleii in particle accelerators and make the beams collide to produce
fusion. I assume the problem would be that even though there's enough
energy in the collision the nucleii would just fly apart before they
had time to fuse.

To counteract this problem I've been thinking that one could use a
"funnel" to keep the beams together long enough for fusion to occur.
One could fire a beam of tritium nucleii and a beam of deuterium
nucleii at 45 degrees to each other into an electrostatically
positively charged tube. The beams would collide at high energies but
the nucleii would be prevented from scattering away from each other by
the electrostatic repulsion from the tube. Hopefully the nucleii would
fuse to produce helium nucleii which would be ejected at high velocity
out of the other end of the tube.
Back to top
Google

Back to top
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic Page 1 of 1 [3 Posts] View previous topic :: View next topic
The time now is Tue Jun 27, 2017 2:01 am | All times are GMT
Forum index » Science and Technology » Physics » Fusion
Jump to:  

Similar Topics
Topic Author Forum Replies Last Post
No new posts Question about the path of a particle in Schwarzschild re... Oh No Research 5 Mon Jul 10, 2006 3:55 am
No new posts Cold fusion in hyper space? Fusion Fred in Fractallan Fusion 0 Sat Jul 08, 2006 7:49 am
No new posts Fusion experiments you can do The Real Chris Fusion 0 Tue Jul 04, 2006 9:54 pm
No new posts (On studying Fine Particle Physics) Quote from Rev. 3.2 o... Leonardo Been Particle 0 Thu Jun 29, 2006 3:39 am
No new posts Baratin and Freidel: a spin foam model of ordinary partic... John Baez Research 0 Mon Jun 19, 2006 8:48 pm

Copyright © 2004-2005 DeniX Solutions SRL
Other DeniX Solutions sites: Electronics forum |  Medicine forum |  Unix/Linux blog |  Unix/Linux documentation |  Unix/Linux forums  |  send newsletters
 


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
[ Time: 0.1160s ][ Queries: 20 (0.0986s) ][ GZIP on - Debug on ]